WHAT IS YOUR DEPT POLICY ON FIREHOUSE KEYS FOR JR'S?

[LHFDstemmy]

I am a x-junior now FF. I was wondering what other depts have in their policies about giving jrs keys to the firehouse. My dept for instance doesnt allow it because its in our by-laws but I want to get that changed so I'm lloking for a good system to propose to the board for giving keys out to qualified Jr members

[BURNSEMS]

It is our Policy that no Junior Fire Fightrers be issued Keys to the Building, They cant Drive and are only allowed Limited Fire Fighting Application so there is no need for them to Beat Feet to the Station, they may if no Other qualified Fire Fighter arrives Ride 3RD OUT,, But they can only do support roles on Scene...

[Kramer1075]

Our policy is that we have to be inside the the firehouse by 11:00pm. The doors don't get locked till midnight so why do we need keys.

[NMFD33]

juniors...keys...firehouse...L OL yea right...its ok brother junior...

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Chris Kerrigan
XMetalSxeX@aol.com
Junior Fire Fighter
Co.2 Engine-33 Tower-31
New Milford VFD,NJ


Can we return to the golden age, to the goals we set, and the promises we made. Do you recall when we were friends? Just you and me to the very end-Stretch Arm Strong

[Bob Snyder]

We've done away with keys in favor of push-button combination locks. They afford faster entry to the station when needed & we can "change the locks" in 5 minutes for free any time we want to or need to. Anyway...

We give our juniors the combination after they have completed probation, just like we used to give them keys. We've found that, generally, if we make the rules & restrictions clear and then treat juniors like responsible young adults, they generally act like responsible young adults. For those that don't, there's disciplinary action or expulsion. Why treat everyone poorly when you can single out the trouble makers and come down on them alone?

[Jim M.]

Like the above post, we find pushbuttons easier to use. We also give the combination to any member, adult or Junior. All members are aware of what is and isn't allowed to go on in the station. In my 20 years, the only problems we ever had were with "adults" who behaved like teenagers. The Jrs all respected the rules cause they didn't want to lose their access.

[Dalmation90]

We don't have seperate juniors, but regular members can begin at 16. And they'll receive keys after they've begun to attend probationary training.

Several of our nearby drivers keep spare garage door remotes in their cars...as they pull in, they hit the button and up goes the door in front of their truck!

[Capez]

Question:
1)Why would a junior or cadet need a key to the station?
2)How responsible are they?
3)What problems might occur if you do?
4)What liabilities does your station encour if they do give them access?

[edfc]

When we had jr's they were issued a key, they knew the rules, time in timeout. They also knew what the payment was for breaking the rules. I can honestly say we did not have problems. In fact I have been with several departments/ stations with jrs. and have have not had problems. The youngsters just like anybody else want guidance and leadership from the top. I believe trust goes a very long way in building the character we would all like to see in our younger fire fighters.

[Firefighter266]

Our Department Does not give Jr.s keys I'm one and I do not think it is right because when the call comes in we are most of the time the first ones at the station. If we had keys we could have every thing ready to go I.E.(Bay doors open and gear out)

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Steve"Lips"O'Brien
Jr.Firefighter Unit266
Jenkins Vol Fire Dept

[KATN61]

Our Dept. does not issue keys to our junior's. They cannot drive and cannot do any firefighting or rescue activity unless totally supervised by a chief officer(state child labor laws).We always felt that a minor should not be unsupervised cause it just opens us up to all kinds of liability.

[Explorer_Chief]

GIve 'em a key, if they do something they arent supposed to do boot them and take the key, also no friends in the station unless they are on the post or dept.

thas will hopefully be the rule when i start a post here,,,,but its up to the dept..

Ohhh i have another idea.. Olny explorers with parents on the dept should have keys

[Frank Allen]

In My department we have speed dial locks. Our policy is that ALL members have the combo. Being a small town with almost all members working in the nearby city the JR members normally are the first one there during the day. They can open doors and other important things When I was a JR 7 years ago I had a key before a pager. Plus another nice thing about JR's having keys/comos they can wash trucks

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Frank R. Allen

[Romania]

When I was an explorer officer (I think I can remember that long ago :-) I and two other's had keys to our station house. The reason that the three officers had keys was because we had meetings at the station house and we also did work details. We were completely responsible for anything that happened at the station house (all three of us we 18). It worked well for us, now a few years later that privalidge was revoked. One of the new officers decided to pull a truck out so that they could clean up a mess (the story goes that they droped a glass bottle of pickles and it shattered under the truck, they couldn't get to the mess, so they pulled the truck out to clean). Well they backed the truck into the station and that was the end of the keys.

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Alan Romania, CEP
romania@uswest.net
IAFF Local 3449

My Opinions do not reflect the opnions of the IAFF or Local 3449.

[FF McDonald]

I got my start in my town's Junior Department.

We, as a matter of Department policy, were not given keys to the firehouse. And, as I still understand- do not give keys to Junior members.

I can agree with other people that there can be a few outstanding, younger members of the Dept. But for legal matters, I just don't think that it makes good sense to give keys to them unless they are over 18.

I think that it is good that they like to hang out at the fire house, and I even encourage it. But, in my opinion, they shouldn't have keys to the Firehouse.

Having read a few other posts, about juniors being given keys, and then they key being revoked if there was a problem.....

All I can say is that unfortunately, the damage is already done at that point.
You usually find out that you have to take someones key back due to theft, or damage to vehicles, equipment, the building http://www.firehouse.com/interactive/boards/frown.gif . That is the problem, you take the key away after the fact.

Can anyone think of a better solution? I can't http://www.firehouse.com/interactive/boards/frown.gif

Marc

[This message has been edited by FF McDonald (edited October 28, 1999).]

[evfdjf]

In our town the only junior firefighters that get keys are the ones that clean the hall. No one else is allowed till they are 18 and are a senior member.

[SBear597]

Our department has a keyless entry system. One member could enter any of the four stations as long as they have clearance to do so. If they abuse this, the member is then only allowed to enter his/her station.

Any probationary member is classified as a Active non-voting member which means no keys are issued. After the probationary member has met all requirements, he/she will be placed on the Active voting with full privileges and rights.

Usually the Apprentice firefighters are placed on Active non-voting until the age of 18. After turning 18, the candidate may receive full privileges and rights as deemed by the captain.

[This message has been edited by SBear597 (edited November 08, 1999).]

[EPFD-AL]

Our junior firefighters must adhere to the same rules "regular" members follow, so we give them keys to the building. So far, 2-3 years now, knock wood, no problems. They keep busy cleaning the engine, the tools, and etc. If they're still in school they must maintain a B average to remain active. So far the only non-firematic thing I've caught them doing is homework and term papers.

[BFD99]

As a Cadet firefighter on our Dept. we have a coded entry system to the "house" I am required to be at the station after school,cause mine is a paid position, there have been times I have come in and the guys have been out on a call. Having the door code I am able to enter the building and catch up daily station duties that have yet to be done. I think you will find most people in my position are there for the learning experience, and will use better judgement to avoid loosing the oppertunity which they have been presented. Undoubtly there is always a bad apple in the bunch but I think it is unfair to punish all for the actions of one individual. Give them the responsibility, and if they abuse it, take it away!

[fyrescue]

We have an Explorer Post here. We do not issue keys to Explorers. They may be in the building anytime there is a fire fighter in the building who will take responsibility for them. They are not allowed in the firehouse after 9pm while school is in session and not after 11pm when school is not in session. We have not had any need to give them keys. We have had issues in the past where one has been in the building by themselves and brought their friends in. We just made it clear the fire house was not the local pool hall. Since then no problems.

Be Safe.

Mike

[DED1645]

Our department was actually strict w/ it's Jr's. The station had combination locks to get into the station which Jr's had. The only area secure by keey where the kitchen and recreation room. And they also had access to that, but they were not permitted friends in the building unless a senior memeber was present. The senior member left so did the friends. Jr's weren't permitted in the building prior to 7am and no later than 11pm. The also had to submit thier report card every semister. The had to maintain a C avg. to stay in the dept. They also were not permitted to have blue lights. They needed more experience driving, so they couldn't apply for the blue light permit till 18. Also involving school, they were not permitted to run calls if suspended from school. These policies are strictly enforced. If they wanted to be in the dept. they had to prove it.

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David DeCant
firefighter/NREMT-B
Originally Mantua,NJ
Presently Lindenwold,NJ(I'm not a member of any of this District's dept's.)

[JustEMT]

Explorers at my station with the Orange County Fire Authority get the code to the electonically controlled gates that let you into the back of the station. The roll up doors at the back of the apparatus bays are normally open, therefore we don't need keys. Our advisors ask us to clear coming to the station on days other than meeting nights with them ahead of time so they can be prepared to help us with what we need. As long as we clear it first we are allowed to come on non-meeting nights to practice skills. We normally don't go unless other members are going too, it makes some skills easier to practice. Most of the explorers drive, but the ones that don't used to come in the front door, but we recently had a problem where the door wasn't locked after the meeting, and a bum wandered in off the street looking for a place to stay. We now make sure that if someone uses the front door it gets locked back up. We are trying to avoid using it alltogether because it is not necessary.

[Justin Gershon]

They would give us keys but it is also the key for the bar room and they think that the probies are goin to go back there and get drunk. they should change the locks and give us keys for the front door because alot of the time i find my self wating at the sta for some one to come and open it up at a call. one time i was there for 3 min waring

[Justin Gershon]

They would give us keys but it is also the key for the bar room and they think that the probies are goin to go back there and get drunk. they should change the locks and give us keys for the front door because alot of the time i find my self wating at the sta for some one to come and open it up at a call. one time i was there for 3 min wating

[Rick Bond]

When I started Back in 1976 as a Jr. Member we were able to work up to getting a station key. Once in the department you had to complete your probationary time (6 Month).
Then you had to be checked out on the apparatus. Once checked out to ride, you then had to be signed off by the Capt in charge of the Jr.Firefighters & then the Chief. Once signed off then you were issued a key. The problems then started for the Jr., because of the rules in place it was very easy to loose your priveledge of being a key holder. Remember if they are old enough & mature enough to start learning about firefighting, they must be old enough & mature enough to have a key to the station.

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THESE THING WE DO SO OTHERS MAY LIVE!

[Firegal41]

Our dept has 3 seperate stations, 5 companies. 3 of the company rooms are in headquarters. The juniors are allowed a key to the main hall only. No hose room keys and no keys to the other 2 stations. They usually don't come to the hall anyway unless they're with another firefighter. If you can't get into the hose rooms, there's really nothing else to do.

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~*I am death incarnate But i take no life I am an assassin of killers Yet i excecute no man I am hell's beast to the holocaust I am doom to the destroyer I am Shiva's dreaded bane I am FIREFIGHTER*~

[Raptor557]

Dealing eith the problem of jr's starting and driving the trucks, I suggest this:
Place a lock box in side the station door with the truck keys, storage keys, etc. and only give the keys to the box to full-members. If the Jr. is trustworthy and honest give him/her a key to the station and let them clean, practice, whatever as long as they obey the rules. That way, they could have everything ready when the drivers got there, all they would have to do would be get the key and go.

[HFDPOST321]

basically, our policy is, if yo don't know the code to the front and back door, then you ring the door bell to get in. for new members that we don't really know or trust that they will stay with the post, we just leave the front door open a crack to let them in, then when meeting time starts, we close the door and onloy people with the code can get in. we don't have locks on our doors because thats the way the station was built and we didn't want to change all the stations to use keys. also, our engine is downtown and when the police officers want a break or to use the phone, they know the code, so they just walk in and time 24/7 and use the phone, get a bite, have a drink, or watch TV or whatever. eventually it doesn't bother you, but it did at one point for everyone being asleep at 4 am and hear an officer walk in with his radio on to get a drink or use the phone. but hagerstwn has god relations with the fire police and ems and we all get along well.

[Jr_ AssistChief]

Both of my stations give juniors keys the night we join, just as long as we are out of the station by 10 p.m. on school nights and 11 p.m. on other nights.

[SCAFDEXP]

In my dept., only explorer officers are issued a key to the station.

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Nick Funk
Explorer
Swartz Creek Area Fire Dept.
Post 41

"I FIGHT what you FEAR."

[NRFR/explorer]

Why?
All explorer(exempt JRs)activities should be monitered by an advisor, therefore the advisor, also a member of the FD should have keys. If your first at the station, wait the 20 seconds for the first FF to get their. The reason I say this is because if keys are issued for explorers and something, anything goes wrong in the station, it would be easy to point the finger at the explorers. Sorry if I seem like a jerk, but its true. Similar occuranes have happened at my dept., although I'm an explorer from a permenent company, so the door's are never locked. If you are a Jr., I don't know, because I am not familiar with Jrs. and how Jr programs are run.
Joe

[Engine58]

We have # Code To get into our building. ALL members Cadets and Regular members are allowed to have access to teh building. There are rules for cadets and we respect those rules so regular members respect us. We have access to the building between the hours of 6am-11pm On days that we have school Sunday Through Thursday we have access from After school hours till 10pm. There is ABSOLUTLEY NO VISITORS When a cadet is there by his/herself the only way a cadet is allowed to have a visitor at the building is if a Regular or Senior Member is in the building but once that member leaves so does the visitor. So far for as long as the program has been running the only problem we've had was a cadet being in the building past there Curfew time. Like I said we respect the rules so we dont get our privliges taken away from us. Cadet members are allowed to Join at 15 1/2 yrs of age and get promoted to regular member at the age of 18. I say if there isnt a bar in the station or whatever rooms you realy shouldnt be in then I say go ahead and give you guys a key just make strict rules...

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Andrew
South Amboy, New Jersey
EMS Cadet in NJ
"EMTS DON'T DIE THEY JUST STABILIZE"

[kennybear911]

well the three juniors on our department all have keys.

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"It's a tear from bottled-up emototions for fallen comrades. A tear for commitment to that funny piece of cloth called the American Flag. It's a tear for all the pain and suffering they have encountered. And it's a tear for their commitment to caring for and saving the lives of their fellow man!" From Creation of the Firefighter

[ccfd757]

In our dept. the exp. do not get keys b\c we are reallly not allowed to be there with no one else. And they say we are not memberes we are guest. But i have a key b\c my father is a Lt. on the dept. and he gave me the hook up. I am also the frist person to station 7 so i can open the door for everyone else.

T.Krebs
Capt. D. Weghorn
Central Campbell Fire
Station 7
E-701
Ky

[wlfdtr12]

In our department Explorers are not allowed to have keys. Those in good standing and are Juniors or Seniors in High School receive a pager. I can see why dept.'s don't want to give out keys, for they are major liabilities. In order for us to enter the firehouse we usually have to ring the doorbell or get in through an open bay door. We also have to leave by 10pm on school nights and 11pm on non-school nights, unless special situations warrant further time. We can also respond to calls at any time in the night or morning.

Anthony D. Ruggiero
Senior Explorer/MRT-D
Windsor Locks Fire Dept. Exp. Post 50
Windsor Locks,CT

[titorobfiregod]

Our dept. does not issue keys to explorers. no explorer can be in the station without a FF. the only exception is when there is a call. we don't need keys then because when the siren sounds the two FF entrances automatically unlock. we can then acknowledge the call w/ fire control, open bay doors, etc. the only equipment we can ride out on though are the bus and the grass fire truck.

[cmjones]

I am usually the first one there and can have the bays open by the time someone else gets there to drive the truck. We have manual doors so it saves a few seconds on response time if I get there and go ahead and get the doors up. The Jr's at our dept are treated like any member, 2 have keys, the 3 others dont need one because their parents/siblings are members.

[This message has been edited by cmjones (edited September 23, 2000).]