Amkus, Hurst or something else

[WestEnd #1]

In our area, Amkus has become more prevalent than Hurst in recent years. Some departments are very set on Hurst's long standing service record. Others like the higher pressure, light weight systems of Amkus. I don't have any problems with Hurst, but I love the Amkus tool that our company carries.

Everyone has a different opinion, and I'm interested in the reasons why.

[firemed9]

In my area, every department is different varying on the chief and their preferences. My department uses Homatro. I like them because of their light weight construction, and durability. We have the full set of tools, spreaders, rams, cutters, combi-tool, pedal cutter, porta-power, and hand pumps. They are are lighter than any other extrication tool I have used, and we have been using them for years. I have worked with Hurst before, and found them to be combersome, heavy, and take a lot more time to operate, and place into operation.

[jeg532]

hurst all the way. we have the original set on our station back home that was bought in the 70`s and is still one of the best tools available.don`t get me wrong, i`ve been to some schools and have used other tools and i like holmatro`s tools but my preference is hurst.that`s also what we use at my current fire station.

[Resq14]

Search through the "University of Extrication" forum on here. Use 'amkus', 'holmatro', or 'hurst' as keywords, for example.

They've been thoroughly discussed here.

My vote is for Amkus.

[James Reider]

Check out TNT we did 5yrs. ago and everybody loves it.

[Adze]

Amkus

[cfr3504]

I'm a hurst man plain and simple, not going to argue about what may be better, I just like Hurst. Also Hurst is most prevelant in this area, in our county I know of only one agency that uses anything esle, and they use Holmatro. The new Hurst stuff is not any heavier than the others if you compare apples to apples, ie: 32" spreader to 32" spreader. not he Big old Hurst 32 compared to the small 20 something inch spreader of antoher manuf. BTW we still have the Big ol' 32 in front line service! Probably because we can't afford anything else, but hey it still gets the job done, the only failures I know of were power head problems, and one was with that antique 2 cycle power head that finally gave up and died!

[MTNRESQ]

American Rescue Tech - Genesis Tools are my choice.

Its a little different here in Northeast Wisconsin though, Mostly the Ambulance Services carry the tools and the fire dept members assist if needed (and trained). Mostly they either are gung ho and get in your way or stand back and dirrect traffic.

But back to the tools; Genesis by far is my tool of choice. They are more expensive though, so "lowest bidder depts" will usually never carry them. In side by side tests with TNT and Hurst they by far cut more and can do more. With the 180 cutter we cut the frame on a semi in half. it was also the only cutter that cut the A post on a school bus. they are in my opinion the best, and even though they are $$$ you get what you paid for.

to learn more see the web site: http://www.art4rescue.com/

also check out our site: http://rescue70.org/jaws.htm

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Barry Butrymowicz FF/EMT

The views expressed above in no way represent the views of Mountain Ambulance Service or Riverview Fire Department.

Remember if it is bleeding - bandage it, if it is on fire - put it out.
and extricate when you have to.

[tfd603]

Genesis is the Best. Also keep in mind NFPA 1936 testing. Why put a tool on a NFPA compliant Rig that didnt pass the tests.

[Ggg]

There is a lot of Hurst over here but TNT is getting more popular. We went to TNT due to faster speed, $, to get away from that HURST oil as well as the hyd. hose set-up at the junction boxes. We have no regrets.

[SCNOZZLEMAN]

Our station is all Hurst. Has been a great tool in the past......

[spotthedalmation]

TNT all the way -- we replaced our Hurst tools with TNT last December. The tools are lighter, faster, and more powerful than anything Hurst could put on the market.

I think one of the best parts about TNT tools is their simo-pumps... It really is 2 pumps off one engine... Try to spread and cut at the same time with any other manufacturers tools, and you'll notice that they slow down when both tools are operating. Not the case with TNT tools. And for those of you not fortunate to see the C-25 Cobra or the S-100-41 from TNT... contact your local distributor for a demonstration.

[ResqCapt19]

We have a combination system with Hurst and Phoenix, using the Phoenix oil. Phoenix has a true simo-pump like TNT's. We didn't like the Hurst combo tool and by going to Phoenix we got a combo tool that we liked and could make the two systems work with each other. Yes, I know that Hurst says you can't do this, but we have had no problems.

[E229Lt]

I do like the fact that the Amkus cutter can be used on case hardened steel, unlike the Hurst O-cutter.

[M1NFD]

I have worked Hurst, Amkus, Porter Fergusun and Holmatro. The Holmatro is lighter weight and just a powerfull as any of the others. Its the slickest one runnning these days in my opinion.

[Ford45]

well, i've seen hursts at work, and my department uses all halmatro, and i must say halmatro is the way to go. thats just me though, but it seems like the hurst tools haven't changed much in the past 15 years. like i said, i haven't used them much, and maybe they haven't changed b/c they are pretty good tools, but my company had a lot of trouble with them in the past before we switched over. we have also demoed the genisis. they were pretty good, but i'll stick wit my halmatros. Peace.

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Matt
Newtown Fire Association
Station 45

[mediator]

We carry genisis on our rig! Its a good easy to use tool. Ive tried hurst(you know the big two person deals) there ok if its all you got I guess.
I almost forgot we demoed a tnt and I hate to say it but it sucked! Hope I didnt step on any toes but thats how I felt!!!

[This message has been edited by mediator (edited 06-26-2001).]

[res7cue]

Been a Hurst man for over 27 years, I've tried them all and find the top three to be;
Hurst, Amkus and Holmatro.

TNT, Genisis, etc are good for boat anchors, book ends or to hold the door open. LOL

As for Hurst not changing anything for 15 years, I think you need to do a little research into their latest tools and accessories.

Their Transformer, while it is on average 10 # heavier than Amkus or Holmatro, offers more options than any of the others.

Some of their other tools are the same weight or lighter than the other brands.

We just replaced our Model 32 with the Transformer and it is an extremely efficient tool.

We also operate;
2- Omni Combos
1- 150 O-Cutter
2- 20" Rams
2- 30" Rams
2- 60" Rams
2- Elec Power units
1- Gas power unit
2- 100' Reels
10- Sections 30' loose lines
And all the accessories/ toys for the above tools.

Like I've said before, it's not the tool or system, it's the operator/ technician and his/ her familiarity and experience with the system that makes the difference.


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[res7cue]

Just wanted to add, I've run the Amkus system and it would be my choice should Hurst not be around or would go out of business.

That is except for the Ultimate System. Just to many variables and working components to fail and have failed. This not only places the system OOS, but from my understanding, it places the entire vehicle OOS.

The cost factor of the system, $60k I believe makes it difficult to justify the expense. You better be running multiple entrappments daily to justify that expense. Just too many other areas that those monies could/ should be sepnt on.

Just my opinion and thoughts.

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[PA Volunteer]

We've always run Hurst, always have, always will. Everybody has their own experiences, here are mine. I've seen an Amkus spreader blow up. Never seen a Hurst tool blow up. I've seen Amkus cutters bind up on a brake pedal. Hurst cutters went right through it. I've seen Amkus cutters bind up on a hinge, and was then told, "There's no way your cutters will cut that." I don't think he even finished the sentence before the Hurst cutters had cut right through it. I've seen Amkus cutters get wedged into a seat trying to cut the frame to push the dash so that you could no longer operate the tool because of the way the twist handle control is situated. We had to bring in the Hurst cutters to finish the job. Hurst spreaders you can change the tips. Hurst spreaders you can change the arms ... all in the field. Amkus can't do either. We had Hurst set up two generators, one in the first compartment on either side of the rescue, with two preconnected tools on each. Amkus told us it couldn't be done. I'm sure people are running Amkus and it's working for them, but our neighbors run Amkus, and when working on the same job. Hurst consistently finishes the job faster, and easier. As a I said, always has been Hurst, always will be. And no, I'm not a Hurst rep.

[spotthedalmation]

I'm trying to make heads and tails out of this thread... It's obvious that everyone believes their tool is the best thing since toilet paper, but some of these claims are a little outrageous...

I think before you go bad mouthing a tool, you need to remember that more than half of any tool is the operator. I've cut things I couldn't imagine doing with the Hurst tools with a TNT tool. I've also bound a TNT tool in a place where a Hurst would cut it. I think it all boils down to your experience with a tool. I'm sure now that if I go back to the Hurst Set-Up of old, I can cut things with that which I couldn't do six months ago... Why, because I've got more experience.

Most important thing to remember with 2-Stage systems, like TNT, is to let the tool work... You may think it stopped, but you have to lay on the tool for another 10 seconds, and let the tool work...

I'm not going to knock anyone's tools here -- I've used a number of them, I just like the TNT tools best, they suit me well, and the lifetime warranty is something else... Their customer service is second to none... And the C-25 is a beast.

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Challenge Yourself To Rise Above Adversity and Do The Right Thing

[mtperry]

We use TNT and they seem pretty capable of getting the job done. I like the hand grip operation rather than the thumb operation of the Hurst. Wierd angles make it tough to get to the lever. The Hurst tools that I have used are old and maybe the new ones are better but the TNT set is a lot more operator friendly and they are faster, plus you can use two tools at once. Extircation tools are just plain impressive, what ever the name stuck to it.

[Co2Firslar]

We use Hurst for the most part, we do have 1 Code-3 combi-tool that works fine. When push comes to shove, Hurst is the one I would want if I was trapped.

We are looking for a combi-tool and small power unit for our 2nd truck. If you have any for sale please let me know.

chief@tvfd.org

Thanks,

[LtStick]

We've been using Holmatro for many years and we are very happy with the system.
As it was stated earlier everyone is entitled to there own opinions. Every department has a reason they picked one companies Rescue tool over another and as long as the tool preforms as it is meant to do and the members are happy with it then thats great.

[ddvfd]

our company uses amkus, not for any reason, but we find it very useful, and its not relavent, but recently bought a dewalt recip. saw to aid in extrication

[Firedog630]

Well being a small Dept with a budget under $50,000 we are just lucky to own a pair of jaws we use the Kinman Rescue tool its not as powerful as Hurst but it will do the job plus its light and when we first got ours we put it to the test with city's hurst and we won only because we didnt have to stop and change to cutters as ours are built in there electric over hydraulic so they start everytime the first time and can be used underwater if need be.

[FF.1205]

Amkus here with dual pump and so far the newer larger cuters work great and we also carry the original cutter.

Fight like you Train and Train like you Fight.

[USAR29]

HOLMATRO all the way... The 9" Holmatro will also cut the A-post on a school bus.

I wouldn't run HURST if they paid us to put them on our equipment... they are underpowered totally inferior... HURST sat back and rested on its laurels as the pioneer in Hydraulic Rescue Tools for years... well, NEWSLFASH... The rest of the industry has done circles around them and they are just now trying to catch up.

AMKUS are nice too... I especially like their "panel cutters" and the "ULTIMATE SYSTEM"

I would also rate Genesis right up there with Holmatro and Amkus in performance, but them don't seem to have the service network that Amkus and Holmatro have...

Whatever you do... DONT BUY HURST!!! My one department made the mistake of buying Hurst over Holmator and has regretted that decision (made by the Board of Directors against the recommendation of those who USE the equipment) ever since...

[LACAPT]

Halmatro for me. Have been using for 12 yrs and have no complaints whatsoever. NFPA compliant, all tools they market. Have yearly full maint. check and pass with flying colors. I have used Hurst and Amkus a fair bit at training school and prefer Halmatro hands down. We run with 32" spreader, combi-tool, 48 dbl. ram 48" single ram, and cutters. Also have a complete duplicate set as back-up and mainly used in training. Run with a PPU 2 stage pump, single stage electric and 4hp single stage gas pump. I guess its what you get used to you prefer.

Train safe, work safe, stay safe. :cool:

[MetalMedic]

Phoenix - 0 to 60 inches in two tools!

[T. Barreca, Jr]

We have Hurst in our department.

I have used Others and have had no problems with them.

So I guess it is what ever tool you use and like. Like they say diffrent stroks for diffrent folks.

Stay Low / Be cool :cool:

[berger3447]

Until recently, we had our heavy rescue truck with two sets of Holmatros, and our back up set on our rescue pumper had one set of older Hurst. Interchangeability was the biggest problem with this. Finally, when we had to have several sets of tools going because they didn't match up, we decided to retire the Hurst. They'd make good boat anchors, I think. Holmatro's totally the way to go. They're light as can be but will still demolish the crud out of anything you try to cut/spread/ram/roll/etc.

[LtStevieB82]

We had used Hurst tools for 30 years with few problems and strong service. However, we recently switched to Holmatro, and man, what a change for the better. They're lighter, hence easier to handle, and faster.

[Jim LeBlanc]

We've got a mixed batch. Holmatro cutters, ram and power unit, we have a set of Bahco spreaders. If there are any museums out there looking for a set of spreaders, give us a call.

[captstanm1]

I have used Hurst predominantly in my career as a volunteer as well as paid. However, In 1994/95 my volunteer department switched to Phoenix which was developed by the same person who developed hurst. Until recently in my new position we were a distributor for Phoenix and in the 10 months in this job I sold one set of Phoenix tools and have one on the table now to close.

I find the Phoneix tool a bit more easier to handle and the features make it perform better.

This is only my opinion...not as a dealer...but as a firefighter who has used both.